OT: To cry it out or not? my LENGTHY update now posted!

General Knitting
21

I am big time pro attachment parenting. We shared a family bed until my daughter was about 6 months, and then we moved her to her own room which is attached to ours. She seemed ready and slept well. she turned one on Feb 11th and I am still up 2-3 times with her everynight. some nights only 1 time if I am lucky. She goes down for about 12 hours (7pm-7am) and wakes around 11ish and again sometime around 3 perhaps.

I am still nursing her when she wakes, though I am preparing to wean her as we would like to have another baby soon and I would like some time as a woman who is not pregnant or nursing.

My husband and I LIVED BY ‘The Happiest Baby on the Block’ www.thehappiestbaby.com which was the best book that I have read, and I have read many. I give this book to all of my friends who are having babies and so far we are all big fans. I have one aquaintence who let her child cry it out… for over an hour… 4 nights in a row… uggg. finally the baby does sleep through the night (she is nearly a year old mind you) but there are studies show that babies that were allowed to cry it out as a baby have trust and abandonment issues later in life.

I don’t let my daughter cry, but we don’t coddle her either. We take her camping in the spring, summer and fall, (we went on a 6 week tenting trip when she was 4.5 - 6 months old last summer and had a blast) we went snow shoeing with her for 3 hours on the weekend and it was pretty cold, and we take her rock climbing all year around assuming the weather is good and we have taken her ice climbing as well. We don’t run to pick her up when she bumps her head or scares herself. Instead we set her on our lap and talke to her calmly about what happened and what she is feeling. (of course if she IS really hurt we go to her, but most of the time she (as most kids do) just startles herself)

Many of our friends find we are trying to make her ‘tough’, but one thing I will never ever do is haver her cry it out. It just breaks my heart to hear her crying when she needs or wants me or my husband. The way I see it, if I were crying, it would mean I need something… She can’t say to me ‘mommy, I’m too hot or cold’ or 'mommy I’m thirsty, or ‘mommy I had a bad dream’. If I said any of those things, or if an older child said any of those things, we would tend to them. A baby is no different, except we are responsible as parents to figure out what their needs are.

my 2 cents…

22

Everyone would tell me let them cry it out… but I never could… I couldn’t take them crying it would make me cry… I always felt their crying was their way of letting me know they needed something… now later on when they were just using it to stay up later it didn’t work… my son was laid back though and we didn’t have much trouble with him… my little girl though if you didn’t get to her quick it would soon be such a screamy cry that you couldn’t even calm her down to see what she needed… the whole hold breath thing she did well… I would have to swaddle her, hold her close and in her ear make the shhh noise this worked everytime… I was also told you hold them to much they will be spoiled… but to me they were my babies and were only gonna be babies once so I was going to enjoy cuddling them :teehee: …

Something else the mama bears worked for my son he loved his… my daughter HATED it :rofl: :roflhard:

23

To me it is one of those things you have to decide each and every time you are faced with that crying child.

My first child was colicky and never slept for more than 2 hours. Till he was over 1 year old. When he was 9 months old I was so worn out!

Yet my family doctor kept telling me I had to get up and go to him and meet his needs. Never did he mention my needs!

Anyhow… We had to live at my parents for a bit, and she finally told me that she would check him. If he was fed, clean, and simply bored, I needed sleep more than he needed me.

Well, it took about 3 weeks, but he eventually learned to entertain himself at night. That was good because then during the day I was able to truly give him what he needed!

However, my next child wasn’t colicky. She rarely cried, but when she did I was at her side as quickly as my Dennis the Menace could be left alone in a safe location.

Basically… I have no opinion! :lol: I do think we can err on the side of being too cautious and that if a child’s needs are met then a cry isn’t wrong.

In fact they say crying is important in the neurological growth of the child. That it is one step in them learning to deal with things as grown-ups.

24

Every baby is really different. My firstborn slept through the night at 1 month old on his own, but my second child wanted to sleep with us all the time, and although she did sleep through the night at around one month, it was because she was in our bed! :teehee: (She’d probably still be there if we let her–she’s 10 now!) Now the third one, well, we just figured that she wanted to be held alot when she went through her “fussy time” when she was between 6-13 weeks (she’d scream nonstop from about 7-11 p.m.), but it turns out that once we put her in her own room in her own place to sleep, she was fine and did great–she just wanted to be left alone by herself (she’s still very much this way–very independent and “too busy” to cuddle most of the time!). Although she didn’t sleep through the night until she was 11 months old because she’d get up to nurse which was difficult.

In my humble opinion, I think that babies at one month old really still need lots of cuddling and contact. I don’t think they’re “manipulative” at that age as they might begin to be at say maybe like 5-6 months old where they can cry to try to get out of going to bed. They’re still really young and they are so tiny and so vulnerable and can’t do anything for themselves, so they really need mom and dad still (especially since they can’t really entertain themselves at that age). It might not be bad to wait a few minutes until he’s begun crying to go and get him, but perhaps letting him fully cry it out at this age is a little too much for him. Even though my first two slept through the night at around one month, I think that it’s fairly unusual for babies to sleep through the night so young. And if he’s still drinking mama’s milk, he may still be getting up more frequently since it’s more digestible than formula and he’s hungrier sooner between feedings. My son was INSATIABLE at one month old–I couldn’t keep up with him nursing, so I had to switch to formula, and even that wasn’t enough…we wound up putting him on cereal, too! I hope he begins sleeping through the night soon, Cristy–it’s a very hard period of time to go through taking care of a baby when you’re not getting much sleep to recuperate and recharge. :hug:

25

[b][color=indigo]Babies don’t cry if they are happy. So if a baby is crying, s/he is unhappy.

If a wife was crying and the husband ordered her to leave the room and cry by herself, he would be considered a lout of the highest order.

Babies can’t be spoiled by be paid attention to. If you take care of your food it doesn’t spoil, so if one takes care of one’s baby, it’ll not be spoiled.

I personally think that no one should ever be left to cry on their own. It’s lonely… :verysad: [/color][/b]

26

Not. Remember…they grow out of it. Eventually.

Personally, our dd could cry and cry and cry and…well, you get the picture. She had no ability to ever just cry herself to sleep.

And honestly, I wasn’t going to sleep while she was crying either.

So, she slept in a bassinet in our bedroom until she was 6 months old, then she slept in a crib in our bedroom for a month, then she slept in her own room.

At age 2, she went through a phase when she was up 7 times a night. I took away naps for a week. That cured it.

Just go by your instincts. Each child is different, each parent is different. Do what works for your child and your family.

Misty

27

Cristy,

Let us know what you guys decide. I’m really curious now after reading everyone’s responses.

28

It’s sooo funny you posted this, since I’m getting ready to have #3 and will just have to play the sleeping thing out to see what works!

That being said, with my first, he was/is a sleeper! We let him CIO for about 3 nights–it didn’t take him longer than 10 minutes and he was out for the night! This was around 3 months of age! Went to bed on his own from then on out!

Boy, did I get a rude awakening with my 2nd! We quickly figured out that co-sleeping was the ONLY way to get this kid to sleep at all! If we wanted any sleep ourselves, he slept with us! He co-slept until about 3 months ago–now he shares a bed with his big brother. He’s 26 months old now. Oh, and this kid doesn’t nap either–GRRR! I’ve found with him that if I keep a strict bedtime routine that helps him tremendously! At least now I can get him to bed around 8 pm–I still have to stay with him until he falls asleep though–one hurdle at a time, right?

So, who knows what will happen with baby #3! I’m really hoping he’s more like my 4 year old was!

Good luck whatever you decide!

Oh, I read the No Cry Sleep Solution–very good info in there–I just never did put it into effect because I was lazy! Could help you though! I should go read it again!

29

I suggest the book “Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child”. It does a wonderful job explaing how babies sleep at different ages. I personally would not do any sleep training or Cry it Out until at the very least 4 months when sleep patterns (naps and night time) are more regular.

candice

30

Wow. I am SO impressed with this board (I mean, I’ve always been impressed, but this thread has kicked my feelings up a notch). This subject has come up on other boards I frequent and it always ALWAYS degenerates into conflict. This is such a hot-button topic, and as with any hot-button parenting topic, it is so easy for people of differing viewpoints to imply that those with opposing opinions are bad parents. I :heart: KH - everyone here is always so civil and kind. :teehee:

We are more AP and did not CIO. But I think even those in the medical community who promote CIO recommend waiting until at least 4 months old (which, imho, is still too young). But I think definitely a one month old is too young to CIO.

Others above have recommended some great books: The Happiest Baby on the Block, The No-Cry Sleep Solution, and Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child. I have read all of these and found each of them helpful. One thing I liked about Healthy Sleep Habits was that it was adaptable depending on your personal preference - if you believe in CIO, it gives you tools for that (encouraging you to wait until at least 4 months), but if you are more AP (which is what we are), it gives you tool for helping your baby with sleep without CIO.

Good luck to you - I know how hard those early sleep-deprived days are. In retrospect, though, they were so brief - and now I really miss those days when my boys wanted and needed to be held so much.

31

This is a good point you raise. Very young babies are more comfortable being confined' by being wrapped up in blankets and sleep sacks. That's why bassinets were very popular for many years; they're much smaller than a crib and not as open. Maybe Cristy could fold up some adult size blankets to take up some of the space in the crib and create a nest’ for the baby so she’ll feel more secure.

sue

32

Hmmmm…I guess I have my own opinions about this, but I have been hesitant to share for fear of sounding selfish! Everyone’s been very respectful though, as usual, so I guess I’ll throw my two cents in.

Most of my parenting decisions, though not consciously, probably were made with my own need for independence in mind. I love my children like mad, but I just don’t want to have them on me anymore. I loved to hold them, especially when feeding, because it’s such a sweet moment. But I never wanted to do the snugli, or have them sleeping in my bed, or to have to be tied down for hours trying to get them to sleep. So the best thing for me was to let them cry.

My boys really were pretty good babies, and were on their own 3-hour schedule from the minute they were born, but if one of them was having a hard time sleeping, I just did what Chel said. I let him cry for a few minutes, then went in (popped in the pacifier), and said something soothing. If he started crying again when I left, I’d try again after a slightly more extended period of time. :shrug: Worked for me!

I certainly don’t think you’ll do a baby any harm by carrying/holding him. The only thing you may be harming is your own freedom! I watched my SIL carry her baby constantly–including the whole time she slept. The baby never did nap much, and couldn’t sleep at all without someone’s skin on her. Later on, SIL really was irritated that she couldn’t ever just have some alone time, KWIM? That would make me crazy, but I’m sure that’s not everyone’s experience!

I agree with Birdy, too. Sometimes you just have to take each experience individually. Sometimes that baby really does just need to be held!

33

I just remembered something. My husband’s niece’s daughter always fell asleep when the hairdryer was on. They burned out several of them putting her to sleep! :teehee: I found this site with soothing white noise sounds for baby that you might consider trying.
About halfway down the page are the baby white noise CDs. You can listen to samples and some of the “adult” ones are nice, too.


I was thinking that if you used one of these while holding the baby for awhile then after a month or so he might hear it and associate it with you even when you aren’t there and feel comforted.

Thank you all for being so kind and understanding of each others opinions in here! :heart:

34

Oh yeah, that was another thing that really helped for us! We used a small fan in his room - it was NOISY and it really didn’t do anything as far as a fan function is supposed to do, but the noise really helped. I imagine it masked the household noises and it also became something that he associated with sleep.

35

Did this too with ds when he decided, at about three years old, not to sleep through the night anymore. Worked WONDERS.

Cristy,

I do have a question, though. How much longer until you go back to work? Will you have him in a daycare? How will his caregiver put him down for naps?

I worked right after ds was born (got to quit when he was 1), and the daycare workers stood over the cribs and patted each baby down until they were nearly asleep.

36

I agree with you. Cry it out is for older children/toddlers. Babies need lovin’!

37

My first baby had colic. I’ll NEVER forget those days!! :wall: I could not let her cry it out tho. A few times I put her in her crib for a few minutes so I could regain my calm to pick her up again and rock her to comfort her. When she turned three months old it DID go away. :happydance:

I think if its an older child and you know they are just over tired you can tell by their cry if they will fall asleep in a few minutes. You really have to be the one to make the call on it. But I never let mine cry very long on their own. My three children are happy, well adjusted adults now. :cheering: :cheering: :cheering:

38

That is a tough question. When my son was born, he would wake up to feed every twenty to thirty minutes. Suffice it to say, I didn’t get much sleep the first couple of months. Once he got to where he would only wake up once or twice in the night, he would cry a lot when I put him down for the night. If I knew he had been burped well and his diaper was clean and the room temp was comfortable, I would let him lie in there and cry about fifteen minutes or so. I think sometimes he was just upset about me putting him down. If he cried longer than that, I would try and burp him one more time and then sit with him until he got really sleepy. Usually when he would cry longer than ten or fifteen minutes it was because he would spit up in his crib and it would upset him.

After he was three months old, much against my own initial opinions, when he would cry I would give him a little teething ring or a pacifier which he would promptly spit back out. I could never keep a binky in his mouth, so that didn’t work. Fortunately, he started sleeping through the night once he was about five months old.

I think it really is up to the parents. I know when I was a baby it was all about just letting babies wail to gain their sense of independence and learn self-soothing, but more recently it’s been discovered that it’s beneficial for newborns to be close to their mother the first few months. It’s never easy, especially when you have a baby that takes forever to get down for the night and then they wake up once an hour or more, but after time it gets easier.

39

WOW that explains a lot. now i know why my son won’t go to sleep on his own. thank God 1 year is around the corner.

shes to young to just let cry. swaddler her up like they do in the hospital. she still likes to be warm and cozy. and you can also hold her in the football hold and let her head kind of dangle. and walk around with her. that always worked for me! good luck!

40

My goodness! Thank you all for your advice/opinions/stories, etc.! I didn’t get to check the forum at all yesterday so I had a bit to read this morning! LOL!

Okay–here’s some more info. As I said earlier, this is my second baby. I was 24 years old when dd was born and much to my horror, I found myself divorced before she was a year old. Her father took to drinking and drugs (or I finally caught on that he’d always been doing it…I’m still not sure which) and I tried and tried to help him to no avail. After two DUIs during my pregnancy and finding out he had driven her home from my parents house while drinking (and side-swiped a mailbox), I couldn’t take it anymore and I left. There were a million other drunken events during that time–but that’s another thread for another time. I moved in my mom and dad (horrible!) when we separated–dd was about 9 months old. At that same time I got the job I have now (Thank God) and I was admitted to grad school (Thank God again). My parents were a God-send and kept dd for me to go to school at night. I was still breastfeeding so I was pumping during the day at work and dropping off the bottles of milk on the days that I had to go to class. During the day, my dad kept dd so I didn’t have childcare costs. He worked from 6 pm to 2 am at the time and so he’d come home, sleep until I left for work and then he’d keep her and nap w/ her. When mom got home at 5 pm, she’d take over for him to get ready for work if it was a night that I had class. Now, my dad is the best caregiver in the world when it comes to babies–they love him and he has the most amazing magic touch–way moreso than any (forgive me guys) man I’ve ever known. That being said–he would pick her up every time she whimpered. My dad is also hearing impaired so he always had a fear of not knowing when she was upset (b/c he couldn’t hear her cry) so he’d hold her constantly and nap w/ her laying on his chest. She got so used to the closeness that she got to where she couldn’t sleep w/o that person to person contact. So I co-slept w/ her until she was 18 mos. old when I made the decision to let her cry it out–and like I said earlier–in 3 days she was sleeping through the night but it also was the beginning of the end of nursing for me as my milk supply suffered when I wasn’t nursing at night and I was only pumping during the day. DD is now 4 and a half and sleeps beautifully, she’s extremely affectionate and loving and could care less if we are away. She loves us but she has never really cried when we left (expcept for that typical 1 yr. old–OMG, Mommy’s gone!! stage). People marvel at how well she leaves us and staying away over night is never an issue. A few months before her second birthday I began to date a wonderful man who is now my husband. Her dad is still semi in the picture but dh has really played the role of Daddy to her. Her dad has no custody and only supervised visitation b/c of his drinking problems. My parents are still a huge part of dd’s life–they have grandparent’s night every friday–they pick her up from school, she spends the night and then they bring her home after they take her out to breakfast. We also see them at church as our family all attends the same church.

Enter child #2. Aaron was born EXACTLY 14 months after dh and I married. We are thrilled–he’s the first grandchild for dh’s parents and the 4th for my parents who live close by (my sis has 2 kids too). DS is an awesome sleeper and nurser but doesn’t seem to sleep between the hours of midnight and 2 or 3 a.m. I’m not a big pusher of the all night sleeper–my concern w/ the situation is that dh works and I am returning to work on March 12th. I get up for work at 5 and as someone else said of themselves, I don’t fall back asleep well after I’m awake (although in my current sleepy state it is getting easier! LOL) I’ve tried waking dh during the day as he naps to nurse more frequently–the thought was that perhaps I could nudge the sleep cycle a little and get the “awake” time to later (like beginning when I would get up for work) or earlier (starting around 8 or 9 in the evening). So far, I’ve no success! Right now I tend to go to bed around 9 or 10 (whenever he goes to sleep) and then dh wakes me around mid-night when he wakes and wants to nurse. From mid-night to 2 a.m. either I stay up or dh stays up, whoever seems to be less sleepy. When he finally goes to sleep and stays asleep, he is sleeping in a pack n play in our room at the foot of the bed. He sleep there until he wakes again to nurse. Around 6 am (the second time he wakes), I tend to put him in bed w/ me b/c dh is getting up soon to get dd off to school and head to work himself. We sleep and nurse until around 9 or 10 am–depending on how sleepy we are. So I am getting sleep–but only about 6 hours over the course of a 12 hour span once you count out the number of times I wake up and how long it takes him to nurse. If he’s in bed w/ me I can drift off while he’s nursing but the times that I try to sit up and nurse–I’m awake for all of his 20-30 minute feeding. I feel okay during the day but I’m afraid of what it’s going to be like when I don’t have my uninterrupted mornings to sleep in and nurse beginning in just under 2 weeks.

I am a behaviorist at heart–it comes from my job and my educational background. I tend to believe everything is a behavior that can be shaped BUT behavior can’t be shaped unless you want to put in the time and effort and unless you have the resources to do it. It also takes time and has consequences. That being said, when I read about AP–I find it to be a beautiful concept that I tend to embrace in many ways. If I could comfortable do the family bed, I would, but physically, dh and I are uncomfortable trying to sleep w/ Aaron in the bed b/c we don’t want ot be right on top of him which leaves us hanging off the side of the bed, afraid to roll over or move! I’m okay w/ baby-led weaning, I just didn’t know anything about it so I didn’t attempt to keep breasfeeding w/ dd until she did so. I love babywearing–I’ve actually been sewing my own slings lately–I’ve started to use them to accessorize in the way I used to use shoes! LOL! My mil thinks I’m crazy b/c I coordinate my sling to my outfit!

We have no intentions of letting Aaron CIO right now–although there have been times (2 times) during that 12-2 or 3 window that he’s fussy, doesn’t want to nurse, is dry, not sick, warm and cozy, etc. that he has cried on his own while we were holding him and we’ve made the decision to put him in his swing nearby or in his cradle and sit next to him as he cries instead of holding him. It’s to give us a momentary break (both of us need to see a massage therapist so badly!!) and then we pick him up again and continue w/ our shushing and bouncing and rocking as we walk trails into the carpet!

So there you have it–I think I’ve answered everyone’s questions and given you a little more insight into my story…Regardless of how it turns out, I will go back to work, I will continue nursing and I’ll learn to manage on only a few hours of interrupted sleep if it’s what seems to be best for my baby.

Thanks guys for your opinions, and I too am amazed at how everyone on this forum can discuss controversial topics w/o screaming and shouting at one another!