Coolidge Cardigan

[knitterless]

Continuing the discussion from Whatcha' Knitting? December, 2024:

Ok I’m stuck again. It’s on the pattern for this Coolidge Cardigan.
This pattern is worked right, left front and back separately needing to be seamed after finished.

The pattern has moss stitch, a patterned stitch which would be PANEL D for now and that is followed by more moss stitch.

After working Left Front and shaping shoulder I think I was fine. I’m supposed to have 40 sts on needles which I did.

The next part reads - Collar Extension RS row, there will NOT be enough sts to complete Panel D, continue working as established, K4, keeping patterns correct work in as established to end.

This is where I’m getting a little confused.
That K4 in the middle of the row doesn’t make sense to me as I would be placing it in between the moss sts and patterned sts before working the other moss sts.

Next Row WS reads work sts as they appear, knit the knits and purl the purls.

Then you are to work a Decrease Row RS K1, k2tog, work as established to end.
By the time I get to the end of this row I’m back up to a 42 sts.
I should be at 39 sts.

I’m attaching what I have so you get an idea of the pattern and also Panel D and the part of the instructions I’m referring to.
Let me know if you have any ideas or suggestions!
Thanks !

[Creations]

Hello
I think you might be adding some yo increases where they no longer have their paired decrease within the cable pattern, that would leave you with more stitches than you want.
Panel D is for 19 sts but how many do you actually have now before this row that says there will not be enough sts for panel D?
Also which row of panel D are you about to work? Is it row 1?
I think you need to accommodate for the “missing” stitches.
That’s my first guess anyway… but possibly you already accounted for this and it is still coming out wrong.

[knitterless]

Continuing the discussion from Coolidge Cardigan:

I made sure I counted back from the marker I have for the end of Panel D towards the beginning on those rows hoping NOT to do exactly that.
This is my math not sure if I’m correct…check and see what you think

[salmonmac]

The collar extension is going to continue the moss stitch probably around to the back of the neck. The collar will be in moss and the k4 may be a break in the pattern to help shape the collar where it joins the body of the sweater.

Here’s a tutorial from Patty Lyons for continuing patterns with paired increases and decreases that may help.
https://www.moderndailyknitting.com/community/ask-patty-increasing-and-decreasing-in-pattern/
See especially the second part about shaping with lace.

[knitterless]

I’m going to attach a copy of what I can get from the pattern of the collar. I know it will eventually be seamed to the RIGHT side when thats completed.

It’s kind of hard to tell if it is all moss stitch or does the bottom part look like it has some of the patterned stitch in it. That’s what I thought I was seeing.

[salmonmac]

The photo with the pattern details page is frustrating in its resolution. There’s a clearer photo of the back neck in one of the projects (second photo down).
https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/coolidge-cardigan/people

It doesn’t look like some portion of the patterned stitch continues on the collar in this photo.

See also this one which shows a join of the pattern stitch across the shoulder.
I can’t tell if that’s a size difference or something else. Does the back look similar to yours?
https://www.ravelry.com/projects/tmnixe/coolidge-cardigan

[knitterless]

The Moss stitch does go around and gets seamed in the back to the other side, however if you look at that part I completed I believe that part of the patterned sts also go horizontally and get seamed.
If you go to the first link you sent and look at the bottom picture on that page that’s where I think part of the patterned stitch is worked across as well as the moss stitch which gets folded over it when completed.

[salmonmac]

https://www.ravelry.com/projects/Ariashley/coolidge-cardigan
It may be that this knitter chose to leave out the pattern stitch (or else it’s just not showing in the photo). Continuing the pattern seems to go along with the pattern photo on the details page. Just be careful about the decreases and yarn overs.

Your knitting is so lovely in both moss and the lace pattern.

[knitterless]

I’ll try my best …Thanks for the compliment!
I’m just not sure where the 2 extra sts are coming into play!

[salmonmac]

The stitch number difference between 42 and the pattern 39sts? Can you look at the pattern D sts and check that you don’t have unpaired yarn overs?
You might decrease these sts one at a time at the join to the moss stitch. There’s part of the collar that will be covered when the shawl collar folds over.

[Creations]

I have read it over and over and looked at all the numbers and I think I’ve got it. Explaining it in a way that makes sense could be an additional problem though!
First, I really do believe the panel D is continued, bends across from outer shoulder towards back neck and ends up a horizontal band seamed with the other side. The moss stich shawl folded part is above it.

After the bind offs you are told there are not enough stitches and to k4
You actually still have enough stitches at this point to go from
Row 1 p1, k4, k3tog…
To
Row 1 after bind offs (so minus 4) k1, k3tog…
And perhaps this is what you have done because an entire 8 row repeat can be completed with that k3tog and its paired yarn overs all working.
If you’ve done that you could probably leave it like that because the pattern is complete until the decreases begin on the next repeat.
However, I believe the pattern is telling you NOT to do a k1, k3tog […] but rather change this to k4 and this may be so you don’t have stitches pulling for that double decrease across the edge of the shoulder. It is eliminating the first part of the pattern before it is strictly necessary for the stitch count but may be preferable for the construction and drape.
You would therefore change row 1 to begin k4 and omit the paired yarn overs, so:
Row 1 after bind offs (minus 4) k4, [do not yo], k1 [do not yo], k3, yo, k1, yo, k2, ssk, p1

Either way you are getting to the end of this repeat with the correct stitch count (and your notes are all correct so far as I can see) so it’s up to you to go back and omit the first half of pattern or keep it.

Where you gained stitches is in the next part
Dec row RS k1 k2tog
You can no longer do the k3tog and the paired yarn overs so on this repeat you must eliminate the yarn overs
If you keep the pattern running up to here then instead of
row 1, k1 k3tog, yo, k1, yo, k3 […]
You will
Row 1, k1, k2tog (only 1 stitch remins out of the k3tog so you can’t perform it) k1 [that’s the last of the k3tog], [no yo], k1, [no yo], k3 […work end of row as patt]

I think that’s what happened. You accommodated the bind off stitches but then replaced k3tog of patt D with k2tog which is a shaping decrease. The two yarn overs of patt D would account for the extra stitches.

Does this make any sense?

Sorry for typos and every “yo” auto incorrected to “you” grrr, I’ve tried to edit out the errors, I hope I did so, sorry

[knitterless]

I understand totally what you’re saying. I was tempted to go back and try to fix this but I was looking at it somewhat the same way you are saying.
You agree that those pattern stitches go around the neck and the moss stitch collar lays over it correct?
It’s hard to see in the picture provided.
Thanks for the assistance.

[Creations]

I’m positive the panel D continues (albeit a reduced version with those few first stitches decreased) across the back of the shoulders and horizontal at the top of the back body. One of the ravelry pics it is plane stockinette but maybe they didn’t understand the pattern or just chose to take the pattern out, I saw one they didn’t use moss stitch either, but looking at the various pics I’m certain the panel D pattern does continue. It’s an elegant curve of the fabric from the outer shoulder, nice design although I personally would have written the pattern to continue it in full and not be chopped off by a few stitches.
The moss stitch is also there, to the neck side on the front and up high in the collar at the back and folds down over the pretty panel.

If you go back to fix it would be just eliminating that first part of the pattern, where the k4 is, but you have enough stitches to keep that for that one set of 8 rows so probably don’t need to go back.
Just correct the decrease rows and the stitch count will, be back on track.
In addition to the yellow/gold example there’s this

When I zoom in I can see the panel pattern near the collar under the folded moss stitch.