Yeah…right. :yadda:
Works for me… I can’t afford wool. I can’t even afford to have a stash. I use what I buy right away. Currently I have only enough yarn (ugly brown… and yes acrylic) to knit one dishcloth and I am stuck with nothing for a while.
Yeah, I am just fine with acrylic… I would take anything.
I can see why people want wool if they are going to spend hours (days… weeks… months!) on a sweater or shawl, but for other things? What is wrong with acrylic?
I’m allergic to synthetic stuff, so i prefer knitting with natural fibers.
Contiknitter - I’m with you on this one :teehee:!
I don’t buy acrylic, but i have acrylic stash my grandma gave me, so i’m using it for the oddball blanket and a mohair-like very soft acrylic-polyamid for a baby blanket…
[Mystery meat is better than none!:knitting:[/quote]
Unless it has botulism…then you are better with none! 
What is wrong with acrylic mum2caden asks…
Well, as the political broadcasters sometimes say…the following is not necessarily the opinion of this station… so, what I am about to say is a summary of views…so…no-one please bite the messenger…
Some would question the chemicals, and the environmental issues to do with those, that are associated with or central to the production of acrylic.
Some would suggest that willingness to purchase acrylic products is, by default, supporting environmental degradation.
Some would suggest only natural fibres should be utilised on principle.
Is there some yarn snobbery? Maybe shrug
One does has to concede that processes in the production of cotton can also be problematic I believe (I would have to research) tho certainly they are less than for the making of man-made fibres.
Because of mass production and availability, acrylics are cheaper and there is a good point about cost for some. I’m sure many of us would like to see govt’s better support and subsidise manufacturers of natural substances BUT then some could argue that sheep are not natural fauna of many countries either and look at increased wool production and flock numbers with a wary eye.
Any other points I’ve missed?
I got to thinkin’ a lot about the production of various yarns. I subscribe to a magazine called [COLOR=blue]Wild Fibers[/COLOR] It’s proprietress takes her readers all over the world…I mean ALL OVER…and the subject of how the indigenous peoples make their yarns is just incredible! From the raising of the animals, who are treated like family…to the shearing and other methods of relieving the animal of its heavy coat…to the cleaning, natural dyes or no dyes at all, to the commaraderie of the spinning time…and then on to either knitting or weaving. All to support their family…and also to bless the far reaches of Earth with incredible yarns otherwise unattainable.
Side note: this magazine, Wild Fibers…rivals National Geographic for content and quality. I bought my first issue at my LYS. My husband devoured the magazine before I got to finish it. I subscribed, and also scored two back issues…and now it’s a fight to see who gets into the latest issue first! Hey there knitters, it is worth every cent spent! Really.
Well, all that reading about natural fibers from the far reaches of Earth just got me to reflecting on the 5-yr-old Red Heart stash yarn I was knitting. I got to thinking "[U]how did THIS YARN come to be[/U]??"
Honestly, I had never given it a thought before this…and I had no clue about its creation…or concoction.
That said, I will still use acrylics for baby and toddler things for gifts for friends. For my own grandchildren…I use natural fibers because my own daughters are willing to handwash, dry flat. When giving baby and toddler things to friends, etc. I just don’t want to impose special laundering instructions on the young mother. Some young women do not have the time for knits that cannot be thrown in the washer and tumble dried. Been there done that…as a working mother of 5…me knows only too well how it goes.
Well I have clearly digressed from the topic.
Susan P: I appreciate the sentiments that you posted about some of the environmental issues that we face today and most specifically regarding acrylic yarns. Hmmm. Some very interesting info is being discussed.
I heard that our local grocery stores may quit with the icky plastic bags…and replace such with cloth bags that you pay a deposit for, and are expected to re-use. Some of my girlfriends are already volutarily taking cloth bags to the grocery. They are also using “green” hybrid cars. I guess that speaks loads about their environmental concerns.
Well, that’s my 2 cents for tonight.
I like my acrylics. If you shop around for softer ones, then I’ve found they’re great. I particularly like a kind I get that’s really chunky - it’s difficult to find really chunky yarns in natural fibers and these ones are lovely. My computer gloves are made out of them, they look lovely and everyone comments on how soft they are. So technology has come on a long way, and so have acrylic yarns.
There is the environmental impact, but - they’re a by-product, made out of waste. So, when I’m a believer in using everything you can from something that was negative, so you don’t cause more harm, then acrylic yarn fits in with that. Oil companies aren’t drilling for the sake of our knitting habits, but if we can prevent some of it from going to waste and into the ground and the water, then all to the good.
lol, I should make it clear… I am no longer using plastic bags, I walk everywhere, take public transit if I must… i actually don’t really use acrylic, but cotton. I was just whiny last night because I am out of yarn to knit with, hehe.
For me, the wool issue is more than a natural vs synthetic thing … sheep are horribly mistreated to get the wool and I just don’t really like to use it because I continually think of that.
I am actually on the fence about all of this for many reasons, both the animal cruelty to get wool, and the enviromental factor with acrylics. I am stuck with which is the lesser of two evils and I have to choose. But you add in the money factor and I don’t really get a choice, you just can’t knit everything with cotton!
I guess what I am trying to say is, everyone does the best they can with what they have. For those who can afford it, wool, silk, etc must be great, but for those who can’t? Well you wouldn’t want to make someone feel bad just because they have no other option.
To Artlady: Thanks for that link, someday when I can actually be done with school and can afford wool to knit with, I plan on having a source for wool where I know the animals are treated well, if I can at all help it!
:cheering::cheering:
(though I have to confess that I’ve become a sort of yarn snob since visiting here… it’s y’all’s fault!! :lol: )
Some acrylics can be soft. Like Caron Simply soft. Heck even microspun is soft. So I see lots of advantages to acrylic, allergics, cheaper price, more choices, more available and some other reasons people mentioned. Yes I love natrual fibers but they are very expensive (which I don’t get since there are probably more sheep than people in some countries) so this can be a very political issue for some people. I try to have an open heart about the choices people can make about the yarn they can use. So let’s have some compassion for those who acrylic is their only choice. 
Well said, feministmama. I like natural fibers, but it seems that I’m developing a sensitivity to most animal fibers, so I probably won’t be able to knit with them anymore since I can’t wear them. There are only 2 LYS nearby (“nearby” being 45 minutes away anyway, and at these gas prices…well, enough said there!), and one of them closed. Neither of them has a great selection of yarn anyway, so it makes the drive really a waste of time.
I’m not sure why people highly criticize manmade [U][I]yarns[/I][/U] when many people wear some type of manmade [I][U]fabric[/U][/I]/shoes, etc. and don’t think twice about that. Nylon is manmade, and so are acetate fabric, polyester, and lycra/spandex, to name a few; most people I know opt for fabrics containing either polyester, acetate, or lycra/spandex because they are easy care and require little “maintenance” (ironing, etc.). It just seems to me that nowadays, you can’t win. If you opt for manmade fibers/garments, people criticize it for its “cheapness” and damage to the environment, but if you wear animal products (leather, wool, etc.), then you have animal rights activists speaking out.
For those that prefer knitting with natural fibers–and I myself do, but I can’t always afford it or find a selection of what I need–that’s great. For those that prefer knitting with manmade fibers, I’m not sure where all of the controversy comes from–if you yourself choose not to use it, then don’t, but please don’t criticize those that do. I knit with acrylics sometimes, and like willowangel said, acrylic yarn has come a long way–I’ve found acrylic yarns that are WAY softer than some of the big name pricey wool yarns. It doesn’t make you less of a knitter because you use acrylics. Just knit–use anything! I saw a book where somebody knitted old plastic bags to make a recycled bag to make positive use of those old bags. You are a knitter as long as you knit–it doesn’t matter what kind of fiber you use.
[COLOR=blue]Willowangel! Thank you for your contribution to this Train! You make an excellent point! [/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]Hi Cookworm! Thank you for your contribution as well! You expressed some excellent sentiments! I agree with you…JUST KNIT…and that is what REALLY COUNTS in the long run![/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]I don’t think any of our fellow knitters here at KH look down upon anyone for their yarn choices! I certainly don’t! [/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]The subject of yarn is a passionate subject. I guess it comes from our 
LOVE OF YARN! Anything we love we are passionate about![/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]Knit on Sister! And thanks again for your contribution! 
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Actually, you have plenty of other non-wool options.
Rayon (viscose) is great to knit with and has beautiful drape and luster. Soy, hemp, linen, bamboo and corn fiber are all plant based. Blends of these natural fibers with acrylic and nylon can be gorgeous and not particularly expensive.
Amy Singer’s book, No Sheep for You, has information on knitting with these wool-free fibers.
From earlier posts:
There is the environmental impact, but - they’re a by-product, made out of waste. So, when I’m a believer in using everything you can from something that was negative, so you don’t cause more harm, then acrylic yarn fits in with that. Oil companies aren’t drilling for the sake of our knitting habits, but if we can prevent some of it from going to waste and into the ground and the water, then all to the good.
[COLOR=blue][B]Willowangel! Thank you for your contribution to this Train! You make an excellent point!
To be honest, I can’t agree totally with the point. Well, I do and I don’t. Number one I’m not sure that acrylics etc ARE made from byproducts only and would be interested to see a reference for that. I don’t mean this question offensively but I pose this from the basis of information gathering. However, a major contemporary issue is cutting down on the use of fossil fuels. In other words we should be focusing more closely on ensuring byproducts are considerably lessened because the initial industry is lessened.
I think some countries do tend to have a cultural/societal acceptance of having large vehicle, multi car family units and when that is entrenched trying to bring people back to less powerful and smaller vehicles that run on solar or other means is difficult. Some people actively resist any concept of reducing what they have or doing ‘it’ differently.
I DO agree…entirely…that if an industry does have byproducts then using them in some manner or form for ‘good’ is important BUT…personally…I see that acceptance as short term and that those byproducts should not necessarily be accepted as such (because the initial industry as it stands should not be accepted).
For my part, I look across the world at the INCREDIBLE national parks and heritage we have. It saddens me to know that acid rain is eating away at so many european buildings and that the Black Forest and so on is under threat from the greenhouse effect and pollution and so on. The US has fabulous…truly fabulous…national parks…as we do in Australia…and I’d like to think my great grandkids will see them at least as they are now and not, eventually, just as holograms in some future museum that has to show what the environment ‘was’ and not is.
These topics are very emotive and evocative and it’s always hard not to step on other’s shoes so I apologise if I’ve caused offence - that was unintended. But as a former educator I used to watch individual teachers talking to kids about how to use say plastic soda bottles (recycling ideas) and whilst that IS important…in the longer term finding better environmentally friendly and safe options is more important. Short and long term visions need to walk hand in hand.
Do I use acrylics at times…yes. So, I admit that and would wear the allegation of hypocricy I do rarely use them but I do. I don’t buy man-made fibre clothes unless I am absolutely forced to. I buy cotton underwear including bras (tho sometimes you can’t avoid a man-made fiber section on them). I advocate science research units that look to solutions for chemicals and other processing issues. I press for govt support of such research rather than sitting back and watching govt’s support the fossil fuel industries. I try at least and meet my conscience and pay loads of penance for when I do make a purchase that I know has potentially threatened a beautiful old tree in Yosemite or a rare Bird Wing Butterfly here.
Sorry, I have soap boxed. :oo:
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Aside from sheep not being indigenous to come countries, I do not, honestly, understand the issue of using wool. It seems to have arisen from the mulesing issue (don’t get me started on that as I know I will be politically incorrect :-)) but shearing sheep does not harm the sheep as such. I’ve been in a number of shearing sheds and on sheep stations or properties and I don’t see what the problem is…aside from cloven hooved animals being a bad choice for some geographical terrains (Australia has one of the lowest top soils in the world meaning we are very prone to erosion and one can see what cloven hooved animals would do to some of our land after clear felling).
Hemp however is a great choice I think though I know little of the processing. I also saw a really odd yarn the other day and for the life of me can’t recall what it was made from but I blinked cos it was unusual…but it looked incredibly interesting.
By the way, sorry about the blue font in last post. I followed on from ArtLady
For me it is the mulesing issue…sheering them isn’t so much an issue, though I am sure they get injured from that at times too.
I am interested to hear your take on mulesing, actually. I mean, maybe I am missing something, but I just don’t believe it is necessary, and I believe it’s just downright cruel.
However- I will admit, I have never seen sheep outside of small family farms where I know this isn’t done to them…
I do have compassion by the way on the basis of cost. To me these topics are about kicking ideas and understandings around. As I said in an earlier post, I believe govt’s need to sometimes step in and subsidise an industry and if govt’s cared that much about enviro issues they would do that. It wouldn’t be so bad if the farmers were the ones making the large profits but often they’re not.
Has anyone here ever knitted with the corn fibres etc mentioned? I was wondering about ongoing pest control (which is a naive question maybe LOL)
mum2caden. Oookkkkk…but I hope this doesn’t start a heated argument with anyone. I think this is one of experience and perspective.
As I’ve said, I’ve been around sheep country for twenty years or so and I’ve read a lot about mulesing and I’ve talked to a lot of sheep ‘farmers’ about the process.
Let me say that if there was a better cost effective way I would advocate it but currently there is not. The problem I feel with many animal rights activists is that they fail to actually get active on farms and considering the issues ‘on the ground’ and then work with farmers and researchers to resolve concerns. For example, I’ve read several articles from animal rights saying that farmers should simply inspect and wash animals where required for fly strike.
That is impossible and impractical. As you suggest, on small farms you can manage fine but on a large property with thousands of sheep across many paddock areas you simply cannot do second day checks. There are a significant number of tasks as it is. I have a friend who runs her own sheep property with three children. Whilst she does employ paid help for some roles she often has to dose a couple of thousand sheep on her own and so on. Fencing, dosing, paddocks work, another round of injections, lambing, hay or additional feed allocation and so on and on.
If you’ve never seen a sheep that’s fly blown it is a truly awful site. Flies will lay eggs around the crutch area and the maggots literally burrow into the sheep’s flesh. It is agony for the sheep and it is an agony that does not end. The infestation multiplies at an incredible rate and you wind up having to put the sheep down.
Mulesing is not pretty and I agree…absolutely…a better way needs to be done…even if you inject the area with a local anaesthetic that is fast acting (though you have to again consider what time delays mean in practical terms for a farmer). I have seen a mulesing done. A practiced operator grabs the sheep and it is over very very quickly, ointment liberally applied and all the sheep I saw were baaing and happily cropping minutes later.
As it currently stands this is better for a sheep than the potential of fly blow.
BUT…there are breeds of sheep that do not have wool around the crutch area and do not need mulesing at all and to me THIS is one issue that has not been advocated adequately…moving to other breeds.
Of course, certain sheep breeds cope with some environments better than others and one also has to remember that some sheep stations have been active for decades and have thousands upon thousands of dollars invested in blood lines and so on. Again, this comes down to a govt saying…ok…we need to work with you to move over to this other breed and/or we need to find an alternative to mulesing.
Sorry for typos and spelling mistakes. Site=sight and so on.
I should also say that in swapping sheep breeds the consumer needs re-education about yarn and material quality etc. I know some knitters who only prize merino yarns and the merino needs mulesing. There is sometimes consumer resistance to new product but that’s when large fashion houses etc can some to the party and market.
Some of the breeds that do not need mulesing are on properties that do do their own yarn spinning so it can be worth doing some net searches and supporting these folk and not thinking buying wool necessarily equates cruelty to animals.
I completely support choice but it may be good to know that you could in fact buy wool from independent people and know it was ok within your value frame to do so.