Separate question for the hazel sweater. The short row instructions (and she suggests the german short row technique) are:
Row 1 (RS): Join new yarn and work * k3, p3 *, repeat from * to * a total of 3 (3) 4 (4) – (–) 3 (4) – times (meaning 18 (18) 24 (24) – (–) 18 (24) – sts have been worked). The rib pattern (k3, p3) has
now been established and is worked throughout the rest of the sleeve. Turn.
*Row 2 (WS): Work 18 (18) 24 (24) – (–) 18 (24) – sts in rib as they appear to where new yarn is joined. Work 2 more sts in rib as the pattern dictates. Turn.
*
My math says that if I knit only 18 stitches on the RS then turn, I would only have 17 stitches to work before I hit where I joined new yarn (and the row 2 instructions suggests that I should work 18 stitches to arrive at that spot). Should I knit 18 stitches in (k3, p3) rib then knit one extra stitch and that will be the stitch I use to turn so I have 18 stitches to work?
If you’re working German short rows you would need to knit 19, turn and make the double stitch. So as you say, work that one extra stitch then turn. Sometimes it’s the difference between wrap and turn, and GSR even though the pattern is recommending GSR. As long as you’re consistent and you arrive back at the new yarn join, it should be ok.
1 Like
Oh no. So I continued to knit an extra stitch beyond the “work two more stitches after”… and then using that third stitch to turn.
Row 1 (RS): Work in established rib pattern to 2 sts after the last RS turn (meaning work the short row
stitch from before and then work 2 more sts). Turn.
Row 2 (WS): Work in established rib pattern to 2 sts after the last WS turn. Turn.
Work Rows 1 and 2 a total of 14 (14) 14 (14) 17 (17) 20 (20) 23 times (on the last WS row you turn when there are 6 sts left of the round).
However, I have only completed rows 1 and 2, a total 10 times before hitting 6 stitches left. I know I had the correct amount of stitches cast on so I think it’s an issue of knitting an extra stitch before turning. I could sneak in one more set of short rows - but how will that affect the fit of the sleeve? How will the shoulder of the sleeve be affected by having 8 fewer rows (4 sets of 2) of short row shaping?
I’m sorry that the extra stitch led you down the wrong path. If you work to 18sts then turn and disregard the direction to work 18sts back but instead work to where to new yarn was joined will that work? Then on succeeding rows just work 2sts past the last turn and turn. That may be where the extra stitch wasn’t necessary.
How many short rows or sets of short rows are there for the sleeve cap? How many sts have you total at the beginning of these directions for the sleeve (90?)?
The instruction to “work to where new yarn is joined” is a bit confusing, because you need to work 2 stitches past that point, but I guess it’s because you haven’t established the rib on those two stitches yet.
I don’t think you need to do any extra stitches, just turn when it says to, 2 stitches past your previous turn.
K3,p3 for 18, turn.
Rib for 20 sts, turn.
Rib for 22 sts, turn.
Etc.
There are 90 stitches total and you slip 36 stitches from the left needle to the right needle (starting at BOR) and then do 14 sets of short rows (2 rows)
I agree with ColoCro that you don’t have to continue with the extra sts on the following short rows. Ignore the direction to work to the start of the yarn join and just work 18sts.
Look at the knit side half of the short rows for the moment. If there are 14 sets that’s 2sts past on each knit side or 28sts. You’ve already worked 18sts (ignoring the direction about working to the initial yarn join) so that’s 18+28=46sts which is almost what you have in half the sleeve sts (half of 90 or 45sts). Work one stitch past for the last set and it will work out.
The same will go for the purl side short rows. It was just simpler to look at one side of the short row sets.
I think I messed up yet again!
I frogged my sleeve and restarted.
I slipped 36 stitches from the left needle the right needle.
Row 1 (RS): Join new yarn and work * k3, p3 *, repeat from * to * a total of 3 (3) 4 (4) – (–) 3 (4) – times (meaning 18sts have been worked). The rib pattern (k3, p3) has now been established and is worked throughout the rest of the sleeve. Turn.
Then I adapted the second row - I only knit until I hit the part where the new yarn was joined, which was 17 stitches, since I turned the 18th stitch from the RS. So
*Row 2 (WS): Work 17 sts in rib as they appear to where new yarn is joined. Work 2 more sts in rib as the pattern dictates. Turn.
Then I did the repeats without doing an extra stitch I just knit two after the turn, then turned that second stitch. I’m near certain I counted correctly for every row that I was only knitting two more stitches after the turn. This is my third time knitting the sleeve so I was constantly counting!
I’m supposed to repeat rows 1 and 2 14 times until I have 6 stitches left of the round on the last WS row when I turn.
I’ve gotten to the part where I have six stitches left - however I only have 24 rows on my needles (I’ve counted from the part of the sleeve where you start the short rows, stitch 37). And what’s also weird is that I have 24 stitches left of the round after my last RS turn.
I think I’m only supposed to have eight left….how on earth have I messed this up?
I’m not sure I understand how many sts you now have left between turns, 6sts or 24sts? The 6sts remaining after the WS turn should be the same for both RS and WS?
At this point you’ve worked 24rows out of 28 and it seems to me that that should be enough to keep on with the sleeve. How does the cap shaping look to you?
Take good notes so that you can repeat what you’ve done for the second sleeve.
I made a diagram to show the stitches situation:
The pink Ks are unworked stitches, the Ts are the turned stitches that haven’t been worked. I marked 37 on the diagram because that’s the first stitch we knit in row 1 of the short rows section.
This is the front side of the sleeve (yellow is the BOR marker):
This is the backside of the sleeve:
Clearly much less of the back side of the sleeve has been worked and I’ve done something wrong and have to redo…but I’m not sure where I went wrong and I’m afraid I’ll make the same mistake again if I try again
If you slip 36 stitches, and then do 3x3 rib for 18 stitches before the first turn..when you do your first turn, there are 36 unworked stitches on the right hand needle before the first turn but there are 54 unworked stitches on the left needle
On the WS after turning for the first time you have:
54 k + T + 17 3x3 rib + 36 k
Wouldn’t it make sense then that my sleeve is so uneven ? There are far more unworked stitches on one side of the Turn then the other.
Maybe I’m starting my short rows at the wrong spot?
The sleeves are worked in the round on a 4 mm [US6] / 40 cm [16 inches] circular needle in rib from sts that are picked up and knitted along the armhole. First, short rows are worked to shape sleeve bell. I recommend the German Short Row technique for working the short rows.
Pick up and knit 90. Start after the first 8 sts of the backward loop sts at the center of the underarm (the equivalent to the transition between p3 and k3 in the rib below). Pick up and knit 1 stitch in every backward loop stitch, and approx. 2 sts for every 3 sts along the rest of the edge. Join in the round and place a marker for the beginning of the round.
*Break the yarn and slip 36 (36) 36 (36) 42 (42) 48 (48) 54 sts from the left to the right needle without knitting them.
I picked up and knit 90 stitches, cut the yarn and put a BOR marker in the middle of the underarm, then slipped 36 stitches left to right from there….am I doing something wrong there?
Hi, i think it may help to place markers before you begin. BOR you have (yellow line).
Place another at top of sleeve, 45 sts each side.
Slip 36, join yarn (red line) leaves 9sts before marker.
Work 18 (up to blue line) this is 9 before centre marker and 9 after.
Turn work 20 (18+2)
Turn work 22 etc
Arrows show direction of work
Another way to think of this which might make more/less sense (result is the same)
Work 9 from red, new yarn, to centre marker green, then work 9 after centre to blue.
Turn
WS work back 9 to centre, work 11 after marker
Turn
RS work back 11 to marker, work 13 after
Turn
Each time working back to centre marker the same number just worked, then past the centre the same number plus 2.
At the 16th row the RS works 35 to marker, 37 past marker, the WS works 37 to marker, 39 past marker. (16th row because there were an initial 2 rows, then 2 rows reapeated for 14 rows = 16)
There are now 6 sts remaining between here are BOR marker (8 on the other side of the BOR marker but this isn’t mentioned in the pattern quoted)
The sleeve cap looks very pretty from both sides. You’re doing this correctly but there just aren’t enough sts to work the full number of repeats of the short rows. It’s close but not quite enough.
Think of the short rows as pairs so whatever you work on the knit side you’ll also work on the purl side. That means you’ll have symmetrical turns after completing each pair.
Creations idea of the markers is a good one so that you’re sure to have the symmetry that you need.
ETA: One thought as I’m working sleeve cap short rows at the moment myself. When the pattern wants you to work 2sts past the last DS, work stitch one then work stitch 2 the turn. Stitch 2 will be the DS.
