I might add that I can’t really imagine knitting in a discussion section where the entire point of the class is to discuss the subject. I do it strictly in lectures where I need to focus my energy into absorbing the material. I’ve never had any problem sticking one hand up to ask a question or get clarification.
I really agree with the statements about different types of respect. I believe it’s important to be respectful of what the prof finds acceptable - to a point.
And if a prof ever told me my knitting was distracting to them I’d certainly quit. Though they’d then have to put up with my furious scribbling and doodling and fidgeting. Which I’ve been told is pretty annoying.
My classes are discussion oriented (Socratic method), so someone engaged in another activity is clearly not participating, though I do acknowledge and respect those who prefer to stay quiet and listen rather than talk. I just wonder how much students listen if they’re doing something else. Studies have consistently proven that multi-tasking is not effective; everything gets done halfway. That evidence has been borne out in my classrooms year after year: very few students who engage in other activities in class actually perform well. If you are able to knit or crochet in class and are still able to learn to the best of your ability, then more power to you; you are among the very small minority who can successfully multi-task.
I should have mentioned this in my last post, and I’m kind of kicking myself that I didn’t. But here you go:
In my high school we do not use the Socratic method (Oh that we did, oh happy day!) but we do, sometimes, have times where we question the teachers about specifics or certain points - Particularly in my history class. During discussions, I usually slow down or put my project down so as to devote my entire attention to the matter at hand.
When it gets back to lecture, though, I’ll let my hands do whatever they want and make sure that I look up as often as possible to keep myself out of that “trance” that some of us probably know so well from long hours of handiwork.[/b]
We get talked at a lot in most of my classes. English is lecture-style. Have you ever had to listen to La Morte Darthur repeated back to you in plain English by your teacher? Hand me a sharp needle, please. Math is much the same, as is Anatomy. But Anatomy is interesting because our teacher uses lots of stories and examples to explain things - And he gets us involved. Doing “call back” types of things to learn the names of bones or muscles.
Him: Zygomatic bone! points to it
Us: Zygomatic bone!
Him: points
Us: Zygomatic bone!
Yeah, it’s weird the different methods my teachers use. You can tell what I do best with by my grades, it’s kind of funny.
Certain classes almost require lecture; I guess it’s pretty hard to “discuss” the zygomatic bone! But Morte Darthur should be discussed–it has such great stories!–not read back at you. No wonder so many students hate English by the time they get to college; they’ve been bored to death by it in high school. :evil:
My best friend when I was in middle school had Asperger’s Syndrome. In seventh grade, they decided to take her out of her classes and put her in mine. I was not aware of this until one day, halfway the year when she exploded at me during lunch. I don’t even remember what we fought about. I ended up in the office, having a chat with the counselor about how she was “different.” I remember being really upset that they had put all this pressure on me to help her in class without even asking me if I was okay with it. Yes, she was my friend, but that’s TOTALLY unfair.
Anyway…I’ve knit in lecture before, but would never during a discussion-oriented or seminar class. I watched another girl knit through lecture for four weeks before I would do it, though. I wanted to see how people reacted to her, because I’m totally chicken. I don’t know if it helps me learn or just helps me not fidget. During workflow lecture, I have to admit that I’ll do it just so I’m moving so I can stay awake. :oops:
I had a student last year with Asperger’s. He also had Turrets. I had to completely re-do the structure of my class to accomodate his needs, and he repeatedly disrupted class with strange noises and flailing of arms. He never had an outburst in my class, but he did have to leave one or two times when he became upset. He was really sweet, and very intelligent, but I did not appreciate being forced to change the way I teach (I mean completely) in order to make him comfortable. Very few of the other students in class were comfortable with him; he sat on the front row and was a distraction. I saw it in their faces every single class meeting. It just seems to me that there’s a limit to what we should be required to do to accomodate students.
This term I have student with sleep apnea who falls alseep and snores (loudly) in my class. (He snores so loudly that I actually have to raise my voice to be heard.) He is morbidly obese and has breathing problems on top of this sleep disorder. He has apologized repeatedly, and I recognize he cannot help himself, but why should the other students and I have to put up with that? The law says I have no choice. Again, another distraction in class about which I can do NOTHING. And really, how much is he gaining by being in class? Very little since he misses 80% of it.
As a pastor, I must say I appreciate that so many of you would never knit in church! :happydance: I have knit at church meetings before (depending on the type of meeting and whether or not I was leading it) but obviously I don’t knit during church worship. And I do think I would be both distracted and offended if I saw someone else doing so.
Reading this thread, I’m starting to wonder if I’ve ever offended anyone when I’ve knit during a conference or discussion group. I can easily listen while knitting, but once it’s my turn to talk I have to put the knitting down. I wonder if others think that means I’m paying attention when I’m doing the talking but not when anyone else is.
I want to start w/ just saying that I so appreciate an Open, Honest, and Equalitarian conversation here as I :XX: !!!
Whoa … so many thoughts float here … hard to know quite where to land … must say … when I get at a stand still and need to sort things out … I make my hands busy … doing dishes, working in the garden, knit, or if I’m really lucky, knit when I drive (lonngg straight stretches like 3 hours from Minneapolis to Duluth) with one way traffic for two lanes each way separated by woodlands… yeh, I knit and drive with my knee on the wheel and my eyes on the road … simple ‘feel-knit’ stuff…
Ha … combine that with some good music, traveling 70 miles an hours, just seems to set my ‘thinking’ in the correct perspectives
… won’t even dare to say ‘right’ in here … cuz I’m sure NOT that… !
I used to knit and drive that route all the time … actually, knitting kept me awake … without it, I almost fell asleep a couple of times and we’re talking ‘day time’.
:XX:
… Funny story as to why I quit (besides I don’t travel that way anymore). My daughter and I were going into Canada for a week or so with her best friend for the first time. They were both about 8 years old. I never knit and drove anywhere but on that trip into Canada 3,4,5,6 times a year. So my daughter just took this trip to mean that Mama would knit part of the way.
Well this particular time, her little friend, seeing me do this for the first time, just FREAKED out in the back seat and honestly, went bolistic on me. My sweet baby girl was totally confused as to why her Mama couldn’t drive with her knee and knit with her fingers … but this little friend in the back seat convinced me that I needed to stop knitting or … drop her off at the side of the road in the middle of no-where.
Well you can guess what I did - ha - picked her up on the way back home a week later … yeh rite !
And what is that limit? Should these students be separated into another class by themselves? Why is tolerance such a hard thing? Not trying to provoke but seriously wanting to engage in some critical thinking about this.
This has been a constant topic of debate in my house since our son started school in a special day class and was moved to regular classes against our wishes. He is still in regular classes, but now at a small private school. There is a big difference between tolerance and accomodating students that make the learning environment hostile to the rest of the class. It is such a huge gray area. One parents idea of tolerance for their child is a strange, uncomfortable and scary classroom for other children. I can tell you that I have met many parents who simply could not be objective about their children’s behavior and affect on the class room.
In a lot of ways, I decided to become a teacher so that I could work in an environment where my son could fit in and feel normal. The public schools have no desire to really help students, not because they don’t want to, but because the system has become clogged with students who shouldn’t be in special education. Special ed can be a wonderful nurturing supportive environment for kids like mine. It doesn’t have to be something where the worst behaved kids are dumped because no one wants to deal with them. Our son had a wonderful experience in special ed and I am so glad that he received that foundation for learning when it was so important for him. Some parents are so focused on how the world will see their child that they fight for full inclusion, not realizing what their children could get out of being in a special class for a few years in early childhood. I believe it is exactly this “separate” education my son received that allowed him to be a happy, healthy “normal” middle schooler. (If you can classify any middle schooler as normal, LOL)
I have to agree that while there should be extra accomedations for children within the classroom there is a limit when it starts being a big interruption for the rest of the class. I think that there is such a large push to make sure that everyone should be treated equally (which is great and valid please do not misunderstand me) that even students who would thrive in a special class are being pushed into mainstream with the expectation that the teacher and all the students will make adjustments for that child no matter how extreme. I think that rather than automatically looking at how that student can be included in the main class room they should look at what needs to be done for that student to have the best learning environment possible. It is not always realistic for the student to be in the “main” classroom.
Just my 2 cents.
If I had my druthers I would Knit everywhere :roflhard:
I can just see success being measured in length of scarves
We did try public school for our son one year. It was an absolute disaster. We were promised all kinds of things that never happened. Because my son tends to withdraw when he is in overwhelming situations, he was considered “well-behaved” and basically ignored. He would literally sit for hours at his desk or at the computer which the teacher “awarded him” for his “good behaviour.” He would arrive home and literally explode from holding everything in for 7 hours each day. He learned nothing because of his enviroment. I found myself teaching him everything he should have learned in school. Mid year he decided he didn’t want to go back, but I wasn’t in a position to be able to homeschool him yet. The only thing that kept him going to school was the promise that he could eat the cafeteria food! Fortunately, the next year I was able to resume homeschooling and we have LOVED it! I love watching him blossom and shine! Yesterday was a prime example of why I love homeschooling him. We went to the National Naval Aviation Museum and he was surrounded by airplanes and boats and static displays of all sorts. He loved reading all the information and being able to touch different things. It’s the kind of thing he can’t do in a traditional school setting.
Unfortunately, where we live, the school system is overburdened with children with unique needs. The resources are spread so thinly that most of the kids are negatively impacted by their experience in schools. I’m not blaming the teachers for this, but the administration and school districts for failing to properly fund and hire! I can’t tell you the number of people who have pulled their exceptional children out of school because of frustration with the public schools. I’m talking about those with special needs like my son as well as those children who are above the median who are bored and unchallenged!
I highlighted what I felt to be a significant thing in these studies. For the average learner multi-tasking is not effective. However, for a small group of people it is advantageous. I’m also one of those people who could (and does) easily participate in discussion even when I am knitting, I do it all the time. I think that is one of the problems with wanting everyone to learn in the same way. Some people just can’t! I know people who literally feel like they are suffocating if they can’t do something active with their hands at all times. These are the doodlers, pencil tappers, paper folders, knuckle crackers, and, yes, knitters. Our hands have gray matter in them. It’s a small amount, but the only part of our body other than our brain where gray matter exists. Anyone who has learned to do something manually well such as play an instrument, type, knit, write, twirl a baton can do these things with little brain thought. It’s believed that the gray matter in our hands learns the patterns of these actions and can learn to do them without taxing our actual brain, freeing it to do other things.
Okay, warm and fuzzy moment time! I just wanted to say how happy finding this website has made me. Not only are we all gorgeous, fabulous knitters, but apparently we are also warm, thoughtful, intelligent people who have great conversations. Sigh Who can improve on the perfect website? :happydance:
